Minis Tournament Discussion and Organized Play

Re: DMFs and other tournaments: wrong number of rounds?!?

2088204 — Thu, 09 Jul 2009 14:06:14 GMT

2412136:
I've never been to a DMF, so I could be wrong on this, but don't the minis finals usually start later than the TCG finals due to there being a last chance qualifier ran Sunday morning. I don't think I've seen it done at all of them, but I think they did it at Sydney. Time would definately be a factor if that were the case. Starting a 7 or 8 round tournament with a Top 8 at 1 or 2 pm is going to make for a long long long day for everybody involved.

sure... infact I suppose they are changing their own rules for that reason... but probably since rules ask for those rounds a different format would be better in the future... OR at least they have to change the rule I believe ;-)

Re: DMFs and other tournaments: wrong number of rounds?!?

2412136 — Wed, 08 Jul 2009 23:32:48 GMT

I've never been to a DMF, so I could be wrong on this, but don't the minis finals usually start later than the TCG finals due to there being a last chance qualifier ran Sunday morning. I don't think I've seen it done at all of them, but I think they did it at Sydney. Time would definately be a factor if that were the case. Starting a 7 or 8 round tournament with a Top 8 at 1 or 2 pm is going to make for a long long long day for everybody involved.

Re: DMFs and other tournaments: wrong number of rounds?!?

2088204 — Wed, 08 Jul 2009 23:04:40 GMT

1172772:
I think the issue here is in the single game vs. 2 of 3 numbers. The single game match numbers are most likely just used for (now dead) VS System because they played 30 minute rounds. Since the minis rounds are longer than that, they are probably using the 2 of 3 numbers instead. That means any number up to 32 would only be 5 rounds.

absolutly not... this is what their own rules say:

One game match rounds and cut
4-8          –     4 rounds    (Top 2)
9-16          –    5 rounds    (Top 4)
17-22          –     6 rounds    (Top 8)
23-36          –     7 rounds    (Top 8)
37-52          –     8 rounds    (Top 8)
53-94          –    9 rounds    (Top 8)
95-152       –     10 rounds    (Top 8)
153-256     –     11 rounds    (Top 8)
257-440     –     12 rounds    (Top 8)
441+    –   13 rounds    (Top 8)

plus... how can we consider qualifiers as part of the same tournament since even the band-list may be changed?

I think that single match games have more turn to let everybody with TWO game lost let in top8... wich is fair, compensating the luck/unluck of the single match... it was always intended that way as far as I know, also in other games... it's a nice format... they are just ignoring it in DMF... I believe 'cause of time ;-)

Re: DMFs and other tournaments: wrong number of rounds?!?

1172772 — Tue, 07 Jul 2009 21:49:26 GMT

I think the issue here is in the single game vs. 2 of 3 numbers. The single game match numbers are most likely just used for (now dead) VS System because they played 30 minute rounds. Since the minis rounds are longer than that, they are probably using the 2 of 3 numbers instead. That means any number up to 32 would only be 5 rounds.

Re: DMFs and other tournaments: wrong number of rounds?!?

2439449 — Mon, 06 Jul 2009 15:32:48 GMT

Rules are made to be broken ..

Re: DMFs and other tournaments: wrong number of rounds?!?

1160366 — Sun, 05 Jul 2009 22:35:07 GMT

DMF Qualifiers / Finals are a Set number of rounds intentionally. You are looking at a two part process as individual tournaments, and this isn't the case. The "rules" do not apply because it is a special set of circumstances, and I don't feel like typing it all out. There are pages and pages of discussion on this from way back in the day when they started doing these, I'd advise doing some digging if you're really that curious on it.

In the end, they aren't "unaware of their own policy." They are running special tournaments with certain rounds for a reason.

You're also forgetting the #1 Rule in most situations: Judges and people in charge can change anything they want about a tournament, for any reason, any time they feel like it. If they don't want to have a certain number of rounds, nothing ever forces them into doing it. This is just another example of that. So what.

Re: DMFs and other tournaments: wrong number of rounds?!?

1576609 — Fri, 03 Jul 2009 19:30:06 GMT

The idea with the TCG is that if you run best of one then it takes less time so you can run more rounds. This doesn't really apply to minis anyway. And yes x-1 will make top8 using the swiss system unless oyu have a large number of players on the edge of an extra round being added.

Re: DMFs and other tournaments: wrong number of rounds?!?

2918206 — Fri, 03 Jul 2009 18:56:13 GMT

isnt the normal case that everybody with X-1 should make Top8?
This was the case at Köln and Turin, so i think the number of rounds were ok from my point of view.

Re: DMFs and other tournaments: wrong number of rounds?!?

319784 — Fri, 03 Jul 2009 15:22:04 GMT

I personally think the better question is why does UDE policy involve Swiss+1 for all the Minis games?

As for what happened, I assume the tournament was input as just Swiss (a way better//time-consuming method), and then enough players dropped to lower the round count by one...ergo you would have had six if everyone played the whole thing, but too many dropped, so one was cut. This is a total guess, though.

And I'd heard the Sydney DMF had 9 players, but I don't actually know.

Re: DMFs and other tournaments: wrong number of rounds?!?

1193591 — Fri, 03 Jul 2009 05:51:43 GMT

The rules they make aren't for them.

~

Re: DMFs and other tournaments: wrong number of rounds?!?

2088204 — Fri, 03 Jul 2009 04:32:28 GMT

2399205:
I don't think they've run the same format twice in a Minis DMF (or at least that has been the case in San Fran and Charlotte).

One would think someone in their job for several years would no how to run a Swiss event - but Ian continually proves otherwise.

both at DMF Koln and Turin the finals were showing a number of players between 23 and 36

"23-36 – 7 rounds (Top 8)"

instead of 7 rounds we had 5......!

In Sidney there were 8 players in the final... and the format should have been 4 rounds top2.... they made 4 rounds top4... it just sounds like they are organizing tournament without knowing their own rules... nobody cares??? Really??? UDE? Any hint?

p.s.: change the rules than....

Re: DMFs and other tournaments: wrong number of rounds?!?

2399205 — Thu, 02 Jul 2009 22:28:52 GMT

I don't think they've run the same format twice in a Minis DMF (or at least that has been the case in San Fran and Charlotte).

One would think someone in their job for several years would no how to run a Swiss event - but Ian continually proves otherwise.

Re: DMFs and other tournaments: wrong number of rounds?!?

2088204 — Thu, 02 Jul 2009 13:31:54 GMT

so... any word from UDE about this?

Everybody feeling ok about playing tournament, DMFs as well, with 5 round of swiss when 7 is the standard according to UDE rules? :-O

I think the format was intended, as a single match game, to let everyone with two game loss making top8...

Hope they will change at least the rules, if they pretend TO and players to follow them...

If TIME is the problem I suggest 2 qualifiers only, BOTH CONSTRUCTED OF COURSE, for 2days DMF... and finals swiss rounds starting from sunday MORNING.

Re: DMFs and other tournaments: wrong number of rounds?!?

2399205 — Tue, 30 Jun 2009 22:27:35 GMT

If Ian E. was there, any stupidity is possible.

DMFs and other tournaments: wrong number of rounds?!?

2088204 — Mon, 29 Jun 2009 17:33:11 GMT

According to the Official Tournament Policy we always had the wrong number of swiss rounds in minis tournaments... even at DMFs!!! :-O

http://entertainment.upperdeck.com/COMMUNITY/files/28/english/entry1560471.aspx

in both Koln and Turin we played 5 rounds instead of SEVEN :-O

what about other DMFs? How is this possible? :-O

One game match rounds and cut
4-8          –     4 rounds    (Top 2)
9-16          –    5 rounds    (Top 4)
17-22          –     6 rounds    (Top 8)
23-36          –     7 rounds    (Top 8)
37-52          –     8 rounds    (Top 8)
53-94          –    9 rounds    (Top 8)
95-152       –     10 rounds    (Top 8)
153-256     –     11 rounds    (Top 8)
257-440     –     12 rounds    (Top 8)
441+    –   13 rounds    (Top 8)