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Parties for Realms

Last post 11-10-2009, 10:05 AM by JonnyDraco. 29 replies.
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  •  10-29-2009, 7:44 AM 1850232

    Parties for Realms

    Since theres only two weeks left, how is everyone's testing going for the realms? What teams do people think are going to make the most impact and win?

    Im personally liking velan wall but havent tested it against amalar :S

  •  10-29-2009, 7:49 AM 1850235 in reply to 1850232

    Re: Parties for Realms

    Well.. the only thing I'm going to give out is that my playtests have shown that any team that wants to compete needs to be good in two out of three things:

    - Killing
    - Clearing the Hill
    - Keeping the Hill

    Also, speed is essential. A VP every tick against you really can be a huge blow to your chances in a match.

    But, I think most people will not quickly give out their techs on here.
  •  10-29-2009, 8:01 AM 1850238 in reply to 1850235

    Re: Parties for Realms

    2983185:
    Well.. the only thing I'm going to give out is that my playtests have shown that any team that wants to compete needs to be good in two out of three things:

    - Killing
    - Clearing the Hill
    - Keeping the Hill


    I totally disagree with this analogy. Have you done much testing with the map? In my testing, it's either 1)Go for the hill or 2)Go for kills. There's no team that can do the three things you listed above. And any team doing the killing option will have no problems doing the 'cleaning the hill' option.

    I think low honor teams are more fitted on this map than on the Worlds map. Low honor teams just need to survive/sit on the hill long enough. Velen Wall is an obvious choice, but it has some major weaknesses. All in all, I would expect a lot of wall type teams to win Realms. Ice Block seems like a given, but with that information everyone is running a shaman for Purge, so good luck with that.

    Vashj is great for the killing options. But that being said, monsters suck.
  •  10-29-2009, 11:39 AM 1850334 in reply to 1850238

    Re: Parties for Realms

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    2977849:
    2983185:
    Well.. the only thing I'm going to give out is that my play tests have shown that any team that wants to compete needs to be good in two out of three things:
    - Killing
    - Clearing the Hill
    - Keeping the Hill
    I totally disagree with this analogy. Have you done much testing with the map? In my testing, it's either 1)Go for the hill or 2)Go for kills. There's no team that can do the three things you listed above. And any team doing the killing option will have no problems doing the 'cleaning the hill' option.


    I would say I agree with the first analysis and the second because they are really one in the same. The first "2 out of 3" option was probably just to help remind people that no matter what you do you need to be able to clear that hill so you will be either killing and clearing the hill or clearing the hill and sitting on it your self. I have seen a few people that had great ways to get the hill first tick and maybe hold it but no way to get it back after a break through.

    This map begs for low honor teams to take the hill. I think we will see a number of teams in the under 20 range just because of how quickly you can get VP from that hill. Since you have to hold the hill I think we will see some mini walls made up of a warrior, a paladin, and X take the field. On the flip side though some of the big boys in the Meta will rip thought these little one teams and they won’t get to keep the hill very long.

     

    That big ABC’s I see for this map are as follows:
    Heroic leap - can get you on the hill first tick,
    Breakthrough - can take it back even if the fig on the hill can not be moved or is ice blocked
    Forman’s reinforced helmet - makes you un-moveable
    Crusader aura - get your whole team there fast
    Ice block – get on the hill and hope he does not have break through or a move on crit attack

    Purge – if the opponent has a mage then melt the ice with this.

     

    Now the big Meta groups that will almost definitely make an appearance:

    Vaj - queen of killing
    you can never count her out because her damage output can just be amazing. The we will probably see a Vaj, Tidehunter, Blindlight group to keep the honor under 30 and get that nice “crit: Slitherblade Tidehunter may teleport the defender adjacent to him and pay 3 to Python Grab it immediately.” Since that can move the un-moveable.

     

    Wall – you can’t kill me but I can kill you… slowly

    Don’t see wall doing to well here. To much honor for the map and no way to keep the hill. The absence of any way to get someone off the hill and the very slow killing rate of this team just don’t give me much confidence in them.

     

    Mort – I’m over, no over here, no no over here

    I have never played versus mort nor ever played him myself so take this with a grain of salt. From what I see the teleport ability on this map will only help mort retreat. The hills are just to danm close to where all the fun is going to be. Jhuroon won’t be much help against all the warriors and teams are going to stress speed to get the hill and that might help with tracking this guy down. You still have the ever present warlock DOT love but with paladins also having some good points on this map even those might not help too much.

     

    Jana – READY… AIM… FIRE!!!!

    Killing with the most dice at its finest. I don’t know as zoo will well here because of all the high armor that is going to try and hold that hill but maybe Elanna variant with arcane shot can do something. I am most interested in the Savin, Jaz group though because of its versatility but beware the death of Savin since it can roll you.

     

    Alamar – this will hurt you more than it will hurt me.

    Had to mention this after watching the critshappen.com battle of the boards. This is a team you will have to figure out what you will do about since it is near the top of the killing category. At 27 – 33 honor this team weighs in very heavy for this map but has so much killing power they may be able to pull it off. The key to this team is the hammer of Rag and boy howdy does it just destroy people. All of those little plinking attacks that warriors have like mortal strike and mocking blow can now be much nastier. Mocking blow is now a 4 auto damage attack for 2 ticks. 2dmg for the mocking blow and berserker rage, then 2 more for hammer of rag and berserker rage… plus the tick up for the attack! Sure he is weak against magic but he has 10 life and it will take 2-3 attacks to kill 1 of them. That is 6 auto damage for those of you counting. Plus don’t forget that big hammer now. For the Jana matchups put a boom stick on the guy on the hill and plink away. The GWE wont die when it attacks the guy on the hill so you can just hold that ground for a bit since he can’t be ticked up or moved on top of every thing else.

     

    Well that is what I am testing against. I have not yet watched the critshappen.com battle of the boards II yet so that may change my mind on the Wall team but I don’t know. Hope this helps with people testing and maybe comes up with a nice discussion or 2. I will be going down to Tanaris in San Diego so we will see what happens and maybe I can see some of you there.


    Disclaimer: This post may contain information that is based on opinion, speculation, or insane rantings. If you are an overly sensitive person, have no sense of humor, or have any religious beliefs of any kind you are hereby encouraged to stop reading now.
  •  10-29-2009, 1:45 PM 1850377 in reply to 1850334

    Re: Parties for Realms

    Good stuff, Mendfredy.
  •  10-29-2009, 3:16 PM 1850408 in reply to 1850334

    Re: Parties for Realms

    2678688:
    ....maybe I can see some of you there.



    Cut the quote down just so you know i was quoting you, but very well though out for someone with 16 posts on the boards. Good job and good overview.

    Glad you liked the battle of the boards. Another one is scheduled tonight at 8 Eastern, Isgee v Ohmsofrd, or Zoo vs Wall!
    Minis Rules - Level 2
    PM- Level 1
    2009 Durotar Realms Minis Top 8

    I ROLL AT:
  •  10-29-2009, 8:28 PM 1850536 in reply to 1850377

    Re: Parties for Realms

    2977849:
    Good stuff, Mendfredy.

    Seconded.

  •  10-30-2009, 12:10 PM 1850782 in reply to 1850536

    Re: Parties for Realms

    thank you everyone for the praise. as Devlonir said I am still holding back a bit of my tech with this writeup. I made no mention of the couple teams I am testing right now and there is at least 1 more effect from crit or ABC that I did not mention that can be key on this map. the only reason I did not put it into my writeup is that I have not seen it talked about much on the boards as of yet and I want people to think for them selfs not just play the percived Meta. I can tell you that it is very unlikly that I will play one of the teams I have listed since I just don't like doing popular things.

    in closing I will give a hint to the other effect that works well on this map that I have noticed:

    when trying to keep the other team off the hill there are 2 good ways to do this. first is to put a body up there like a character or pet. the second way is to...

    Disclaimer: This post may contain information that is based on opinion, speculation, or insane rantings. If you are an overly sensitive person, have no sense of humor, or have any religious beliefs of any kind you are hereby encouraged to stop reading now.
  •  10-30-2009, 12:32 PM 1850796 in reply to 1850782

    Re: Parties for Realms

    Drop a fireball on it?

    Quite.

    -Ben

    Isgee is, by definition, a snob.
  •  10-30-2009, 10:35 PM 1850989 in reply to 1850796

    Re: Parties for Realms

    Triple Mortimers may have a bunch of fun with Piztog.  With the teleport option, it wouldn't hurt for you to tick up 2 adjacent to the VP prior to blinking away.  If you manage to land Piztog there, then just keep that Mortimer healthy and out of combat while DoTing with the other two.  It forces the opponent to win via kills, which we all know to be problematic against Morts.  If the Mort player wins the die roll, Breakthrough from a Warrior, or a Counterspell on the Summon Piztog are the only ways I see to prevent against this.

    EDIT:
    Thought it out a bit further, and Swiftness Potion/Summon Piztog will let a single Mortimer pull this off on tick 1, leaving the other 2 to play standard style.  I had hoped this scenario would push the meta away from Morts the way that World's/CtF did, but instead it seems to have made them stronger.

    I wanted to give everyone a list of all the trustworthy people who traded with me on this site, but it exceeds maximum character length. To me, that's a hopeful sign.
  •  10-30-2009, 11:51 PM 1851006 in reply to 1850989

    Re: Parties for Realms

    So you've gimped one Mortimer. How do they plan to win? What if the opponent does have a breakthrough? What if they kill the Piztog's controller? Then you just autolose, I think.

    Also, Morts rather desperately need 8 of 9 cards to win most matchups. Cutting one of 2 corruptions, one of 3 agonies, or a Jhuroon are all extremely painful for the team.

    -Ben

    Isgee is, by definition, a snob.
  •  10-31-2009, 2:09 PM 1851170 in reply to 1851006

    Re: Parties for Realms

    Provided Piztog keeps the hill, all the Morts player has to do is blink around the map and avoid losing characters.  We may see some effective low-honor teams that force Morts to get a kill, but most parties depend on VP scoring to catch up or keep pace with 18 honor.  Wall loses outright, Zoo loses to DoTs on Jaina, Vashj loses to Jhuroon damage and DoTs on Vashj, BIG will be hard-pressed to win with 2 Jhuroons chasing Irana, "Jezzy Jaina" has no mobility to catch the blinkers and Jaina will again probably die to DoTs.

    Warrior becomes mandatory for the meta, unless you happen to be one of the people playing Morts.  Amalar x3 seems like an even match, depending on the dice.  Cairne could make the game interesting as well.

    I'm not saying that Mortimers is unbeatable.  I'm saying that this scenario has provided even more advantages to a party that already defined the meta.

    I wanted to give everyone a list of all the trustworthy people who traded with me on this site, but it exceeds maximum character length. To me, that's a hopeful sign.
  •  10-31-2009, 2:22 PM 1851173 in reply to 1851170

    Re: Parties for Realms

    My hope is that Morts win like all the RCs.  Maybe then we can start to recognize a problem.

    BTW, what is the map for Vegas?  If it is back to a "normal" DMF (ie not a map/scenario that gimps Morts like worlds did) I expect we will see a return to dominance of Mort.

    /derail off.  sorry

    Master Tactician and Rexxar...
  •  10-31-2009, 2:34 PM 1851177 in reply to 1851170

    Re: Parties for Realms

    Also, the Swiftness/Piztog thing doesn't do anything helpful. Both Swiftness and Teleport are instants, so that Mort is stuck there until tick 3, which allows every team in the meta full round of attacks on it.

    If you do it the other way and summon on tick 2 and then teleport, you're on tick 4 and probably just at the VP spot. How exactly can you not die out of that, especially since all you have going before tick 4 is either 2 Morts or one Mort and a Jhuroon?

    -Ben

    Isgee is, by definition, a snob.
  •  10-31-2009, 3:08 PM 1851181 in reply to 1851177

    Re: Parties for Realms

    And what if you go second to mage ice block, which blinks onto the hill at the beginning of tick one?

    Sarcastic remarks should come in a different color. Then the forums would be more interesting to look at.
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