Ah, I see the difference now with definite and indefinite modifiers and the "while" conditions. Something like Nyn'jah would be a definite modifier with a "while" condition. I was just getting myself all twisted around and tripped on a single word.

Thanks Paul.

Oh and giggles at being called an elder statesmen.

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No quote for you!

Well, I'm glad we got an offical ruling (not to say our "Elders" aren't a great source, cause they are!)

Its a shame the card (AW) is now offically terrible.  I thought you guys were trying to make Ret decent :)  (I kid).

While I am satisfied with this official ruling gifted to us from on high, The rules I quoted earlier (esp 714.3e) still seem, in my mind, to contradict 718.1.  Avenging wrath shouldn't say "this turn" if it is not going to do what it says for the entire turn, and instead sort of doubles your attack this turn. 

"Double any attack you had before you played Avenging Wrath this turn.  If that attack is again added to your hero, it's doubled, but if a new attack value is added, it is not doubled."

Screw Pallies

: P

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Rules Knowledge - World of Warcraft: Level 1

The modifier it creates lasts for the entire turn, and if there are any other modifiers with an earlier timestamp, like Blessing of Might for example, then it will continue to apply after those modifiers have already been applied.

Edit: 714.3e doesn't even have anything to do with this situation.  714.3e covers things like Battle Shout, "Allies in your party have +1 ATK."  When a new ally enters play the modifier from Battle Shout checks to see if there are any other cards that would be affected by it and since there is another ally in play it affects it.

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Remember: with great power comes great current squared times resistance.

H

1123981:

The modifier it creates lasts for the entire turn, and if there are any other modifiers with an earlier timestamp, like Blessing of Might for example, then it will continue to apply after those modifiers have already been applied.

Edit: 714.3e doesn't even have anything to do with this situation.  714.3e covers things like Battle Shout, "Allies in your party have +1 ATK."  When a new ally enters play the modifier from Battle Shout checks to see if there are any other cards that would be affected by it and since there is another ally in play it affects it.

Well an ongoing ability may not be the proper comparison, since it specifically cites rally the troops which would be the comparison of "Allies in your party have +1 atk this turn" and "double your hero's atk this turn"
Obviously UDE settled it, but I can definately see the ambiguity with that rule

First off i'm very sorry to bring this up again but as i'm new i don;t quite understand and would like to clear some things up.

as i understand it.

if i have a Blessing of Might and Crusade in play. I attack and play AW (heros atk now 6). play rak and ready and attack again, my heros atck is still 6?

Blessing of Might and Crusade in play with a fel iron hatchet. I attack,strike and play AW (heroes atk now  10).play RAk and ready and attack again,My heros attack is now 8 (1-blessing,2crusade+double=6+2 frm fel iron hatchet?)

Thanks alot guys!

1598361:

if i have a Blessing of Might and Crusade in play. I attack and play AW (heros atk now 6). play rak and ready and attack again, my heros atck is still 6?

Blessing of Might and Crusade in play with a fel iron hatchet. I attack,strike and play AW (heroes atk now  10).play RAk and ready and attack again,My heros attack is now 8 (1-blessing,2crusade+double=6+2 frm fel iron hatchet?)

Sounds right to me.

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The hands of a healer

1598361:

First off i'm very sorry to bring this up again but as i'm new i don;t quite understand and would like to clear some things up.

as i understand it.

if i have a Blessing of Might and Crusade in play. I attack and play AW (heros atk now 6). play rak and ready and attack again, my heros atck is still 6?

Blessing of Might and Crusade in play with a fel iron hatchet. I attack,strike and play AW (heroes atk now  10).play RAk and ready and attack again,My heros attack is now 8 (1-blessing,2crusade+double=6+2 frm fel iron hatchet?)

Thanks alot guys!

Correct. Since the strike from the Fel Iron Hatchet in the second combat occured after Avenging Wrath resolved, it will not be part of the doubling.

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No quote for you!

sweet!.....thanks for the quick reply!

I'd really hate to open up this topic again, but I'm confused as to why using Avenging Wrath after a weapon strike resolves does NOT give your hero +x attack for the rest of the turn, where x is the attack of the weapon.

303.2a Striking with a weapon follows the applicable rules for adding links (707) and adds a strike
effect to the chain. As a strike effect resolves, it creates a strike modifier that gives its
controller’s hero both of the following for the duration of the combat step:
• +X ATK, where X is the ATK of that weapon as that effect resolves.
• The damage type (205) of that weapon.

Let's say hero attacks, strikes with Krol Blade, strike resolves and hero has 3 attack.  Player plays Avenging Wrath, which doubles the hero's attack for the turn.  When Avenging Wrath resolves, the hero has 6 attack for the combat, right?  However, why does his attack go to 0 at the end of combat if striking with the weapon only added 3?  The strike effect added a temporary attack value to the hero, while the effect of Avenging Wrath was not as temporary.  Shouldn't the hero still have 3 attack after the combat concludes until the wrap up step of the turn since striking with krol blade only gave him 3 attack?

If I'm wrong, please explain because I'm in the dark here.

All heroes have a default ATK of 0.  Modifiers are applied in timestamp order.  During combat, after the weapon strike and Avenging Wrath have resolved, there are two modifiers that are trying to modify your hero's ATK.  The weapon strike was first and Avenging Wrath was second, so first the ATK is increased by 3 and then the ATK is doubled to 6.  Now combat ends and the strike modifier goes away.  We apply all modifiers in timestamp order, so your hero has an ATK of 0 and Avenging Wrath doubles it.  0 times 2 is 0.  Yay math!

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Remember: with great power comes great current squared times resistance.

Oh dang.  That makes so much more sense.  Thanks for the help, it put a nice little visual of whats going on in my head.