Hm, I must've missing this this thread the first time around when I posted my version.

1381330:

That king of the Blood Elves guy would be pretty good too with a Blood Elf hero, since they probably won't have enough resources to try and push through more than 2 abilities which will both be interrupted.

I am actually running Lor'themar Theron in my horde build. He actually is only a 2 of with Akama being 3 so that they can protect your other threats (and be big). I figure if you combo early then you you shouldn't fear invoke the nether or something, and retainer's blade isn't getting stopped by theron...then again I am not sure which is appropriate.

I am also considering varen the reclaimer. He is pretty janky but this deck can sneak game 1 wins with people being unprepared for a turn 5 soft lock when you drop the drop EOT via you, robot. However game 2 and 3 they will both be prepared mentally knowing your gameplan, as wall as boarding in things that could wreck you (cannibalize can be a beating if you don't play around it for example and won't be uncommon in many sideboards).

I like the alliance version for several reasons. Namely gromble, and find treasure in general. The version the OP has appears to be pretty resilient, at least comparing to the version I am running. In general I am not sure how the deck beats varanis other than try for a ring early (hoping they tap out or something) and pray they don't have a suppression. Other than that maybe just drop huge dudes late game every turn until they cave? That idea seems terrible but what can you do.

Against more aggressive deck the OP version appears to be better also barring a quick combo. Orcs or kil'zin could pour on the damage and a single munkin, or burn to the dome will just end you (another reason to have more theron's I guess).

The main complaint I'd have with the OP's list is the lack of ways to find a ring. Although you have weldon and other dudes so you can do other things than pray for a ring, if you are going for a ring-based win condition in vannadar early on to lock them out, it would seem there are very few ways to go find the ring.

Personally I feel more comfortable with the loyal route simply for akama, and the easy outlet/disruption of emek's flip. Then again getting access to kael'thas, or lady vashj and other traitor options such as this dude even if they are janky could lead to more wins since you do far more unfair things than "just" dropping an 7/9 stealth'd grounding totem with protector. I am expecting more sudden deaths than most other targeted removal so akama is fine in that situation since he protects himself too.

Regardless the deck is a lot of fun and is hilarious when it wins even if it can be tough to pull it off.

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wingedweasel on MWS/Lackey
winged weasel on xbl

Varen is, was, and always will be a pointless card. Either its obvious Varen's owner is going to win, so you just scoop up before he can Sabotage the game, or you know you can win so you allow the sabotage and win the match.

With this deck you're almost guaranteed a win if you can resolve a decent sized Renewal so you won't ever sneak out the second win from Varen's effect.

1733144:

Varen is, was, and always will be a pointless card. Either its obvious Varen's owner is going to win, so you just scoop up before he can Sabotage the game, or you know you can win so you allow the sabotage and win the match.

With this deck you're almost guaranteed a win if you can resolve a decent sized Renewal so you won't ever sneak out the second win from Varen's effect.

Valid point

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wingedweasel on MWS/Lackey
winged weasel on xbl

Thanks for the replies so far.

I answered the problem of not running Akama by including Bolvar so everything must target him and heroes and allies must attack him. He's just bait to begin with, but damage can add up quickly when their hero attacks him and he attacks back.

I can't decide whether Kael'thas is worth it at present or whether to use Vanndar still. I defo like the addition of Short John Mithril. Might have to tweak a few things round.

Any further comments more than welcome!

I played a guy at worlds that had an interesting renewal of life combo deck. He was playing an alliance shaman and his win condition was spark. He played all of the allies with find treasure to throw cards in the yard to dig to the combo faster and he played all of the guys with inspiring presence so that when his ring popped and all of his characters came into play he got to find treasure all over again to dig deeper to find a spark and it put all of the inspiring presence guys on the field so he was doing  5-6 per ally with spark. It was pretty fun to play against and actually pretty consistant. You can achieve some pretty nutty things with Renewal of Life.

-Kama

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1222370:

I played a guy at worlds that had an interesting renewal of life combo deck. He was playing an alliance shaman and his win condition was spark. He played all of the allies with find treasure to throw cards in the yard to dig to the combo faster and he played all of the guys with inspiring presence so that when his ring popped and all of his characters came into play he got to find treasure all over again to dig deeper to find a spark and it put all of the inspiring presence guys on the field so he was doing  5-6 per ally with spark. It was pretty fun to play against and actually pretty consistant. You can achieve some pretty nutty things with Renewal of Life.

-Kama

This idea makes a lot of sense since really combo decks want to win the turn they go off. Never give your opponent a chance to respond if you can help it.

So far the deck over all has been doing pretty well. The biggest issue surprisingly is against aggro since unless you manage to ring for some specific fatties their overwhelming board presence (barring a tendrils targeting yourself to heal for 20+) can let them steal wins if they are holding even a single sudden death, puncture, wub's, or whatever. Wrynn would be great as a come into play sweeper.

Back to the inspiring presence spark idea I guess it'd look something like:

Zorin of the Thunderhead (I guess?)

11 Quests
4 You, Robot

4 Elder Achillia
4 Hunter Xenia
4 Ossus, the Ancient
4 Elder Tomas

4 Gromble the Apt
4 Grudum Trove Guardian
4 Mordric Sternbeard
1 <Other Find Treasure Dude>

4 Short John Mithril
4 Field Repair Bot 74A

4 Renewal of Life
4 Spark


I have no idea if you really need the aegis or something similar, but to ensure spark goes off against something with counters I guess you need it? For now I am putting in lots of IP guys to test. Shocks may be more appropriate or I'm missing the obviously (more likely). I figure before you could just renewal for lots of big dudes and you'd be find vs. mage barring combustion. Now you need to resolve 2 key spells: renewal, then spark. Doing so may be difficult.

There are a lot more protectors to keep you in 1 piece against aggro so that is a plus. I kept the quest base the same and the combo finders since I haven't really thought about it much. The list is more of a baseline so we have a place to start rather than just mulling around the idea in the 'ol noggin. I dropped oilfist for more IP/FT dudes so we'll see.

Actually I can almost say for sure it isn't, but I'll wait to see what others have to say.

EDIT: I realized the quest base is probably terrible for a build of this type so I set it generically for now.


EDIT 2:

Unrelated to the IP/spark version I have again been digging and trying to find things that may help the horde "fat" version (one that only uses fatties as the kill as opposed to arena dudes). I ended up trying out this:

Emek, the Equalizer

3 The Ring of Blood: Broken Toe
4 A Donation of Mageweave
4 A Donation of Silk
4 You, Robot

3 Akama
2 Lor'Themar Theron
3 The Abominable Greench
4 Doomwalker
3 Lok'Holar the Ice Lord


4 Short John Mithril
3 Field Repair Bot 74A
4 Retainer Marcus
3 Ra'waza Stonetusk

4 Renewal of Life

4 Vampiric Tendrils
4 Mental Anguish
4 Lose Control

The changes were:

+3 Ra'waza
+4 Retainer Marcus
+1 Lok'Holar

-3 Mist of Corrosion
-4 Oilfist
-1 Repair bot

I haven't really had too many problems finding a ring so I figured I could do without oilfist who really isn't all that exciting. Similarly mist has been less than great and the spare repair bot generally isn't needed. I wanted to replace them with dudes to both take advantage of ring but also to potentially attack.

Well the attacking part didn't end up happening, but I needed a protector that was cheap (came down before ring) and was durable. Sadly ra'waza was what I selected. Retainer was on a whim. I figured" well meddling mage was pretty good", retainer not so much. I haven't played this game all that long so I feel like I am constantly leanring lessons people already know, marcus teaching me the latest. Retainer was intended to help combat counters. Unfortunately merrick and kil'zin don't give a damn and just plow through him.

I'd say the merrick match was a fluke since he had double taste for my first ring on turn 5, and then a 3rd spell suppression later for the 2nd ring, (I hit marcus naming suppression) after he had eventually killed the scryer. However despite that I didn't feel very comfortable while playing, it was far too easy for the merrick player to both deal with the rings and quickly end the game. Had I even combo'd I believe I would've recurred a greench and another fatty but myriam would've just shot around them and ended it.

So yeah the changes were probably a net negative. I am unsure how well the arena version of the deck will work, although I'd venture to guess that it is stronger since you can trade dudes early on with decks and them when you combo just kill them outright in 1 turn. Not quite as fun as slamming doomwalker, lor'themar, akama, greench, and lok'holar onto the table in 1 turn but possibly more stable. For the 1 turn win you still require 2 cards (similar to the alliance version) to win Right Now so i am not quite happy with that just yet but we'll see.

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wingedweasel on MWS/Lackey
winged weasel on xbl

So in the interest of keeping the deck from falling off page 1, and to post some other results:

I am curious how others are doing against aggro. Initially I didn't think aggro decks would be a problem, the old combo > aggro > control > combo thing. Obviously not always true, as is shown in this case. I can name maybe 2-3 times that I was able beat kil'zin, daspien, or orcs...combined. Really it has just been abysmal.

As I mentioned, at the outset I didn't think it'd be that bad, hence the inclusion of terrible cards like ra'waza. It went from that to including full compliments of johnny rotten, doshura, vexmaster, and some cuffs of devastation. There were a few intermediary steps, but it quickly got out of hand so I just kept adding stuff.

I have sort of written off the varanis matchup and just trying to concentrate on beating midrange and aggro. However at this point I am praying it has just been luck that has caused me to drop so many games against lionar.

Invoke the nether is another problem. I think it may justify going horde over alliance simply for Lor'Themar.

So far the "fat" version as opposed to shaman/spark or the red arena version has been doing the best. The other 2 rely too heavily on extra combo cards which has been a problem when something as simple as undercity (for boum) or a single counter for spark, among other things. The fat version to requires far less parts and pretty much gains a win after a successful ring regardless. 

Also, what are people's opinons on the ring of blood: warmaul champ vs. say ring of blood: brokentoe or similar quests? The donations have been working great, and you, robot seems to be required, but what about the other slots?

There were some other points I wanted to make but for the life of me I can't recall so I'll try and edit them in later.

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wingedweasel on MWS/Lackey
winged weasel on xbl

I built this deck with red, and ferocity and big dudes together and it just is too janky to work, especially since Mage will crush it almost every time. 

If you don't have You Robot and Barkskin together on the board and working then you will never get your ring off.  They will just sit there and taste, fracture whatever you throw at them, and if you do get a barkskin down, it will just be Spell Surpressed, so the ring will never stick.  Also Canabilize and Undercity will destroy your Grave yard.  After playing for 2 weeks the hardest part about this deck is getting the ring to go off, either pappy, puncture, some interrupt or whatever else will kill it.  Short John will find your ring for you, I never had a problem finding the ring, I just had problems making the ring go off. 

First week, 2-1 with the deck, second week 1-3 with the deck.  I will keep the deck built in some form, but will never run it tournament.

Quests I ran were.

Darkmoon Faire
Warmaul
You Robot
Sunken Treasure
Brokentoe

2553717:

I built this deck with red, and ferocity and big dudes together and it just is too janky to work, especially since Mage will crush it almost every time. 

If you don't have You Robot and Barkskin together on the board and working then you will never get your ring off.  They will just sit there and taste, fracture whatever you throw at them, and if you do get a barkskin down, it will just be Spell Surpressed, so the ring will never stick.  Also Canabilize and Undercity will destroy your Grave yard.  After playing for 2 weeks the hardest part about this deck is getting the ring to go off, either pappy, puncture, some interrupt or whatever else will kill it.  Short John will find your ring for you, I never had a problem finding the ring, I just had problems making the ring go off. 

First week, 2-1 with the deck, second week 1-3 with the deck.  I will keep the deck built in some form, but will never run it tournament.

You basically have to alter your strategy. Against Cannibalize, don't discard allies until the turn you pop the Ring, save a Donation of Mageweave/DMF activation. Against mage, play your allies out and force them to waste answers. Gladiator Skumm is also a pretty good way to harass them.

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Zapped Giants - UK Community Site

I definitely DID NOT attend a Season 4 Realm Champs. Ever. At all. Honestly.

WTB Teresa Voidheart avatar pst.

1208645:

You basically have to alter your strategy. Against Cannibalize, don't discard allies until the turn you pop the Ring, save a Donation of Mageweave/DMF activation. Against mage, play your allies out and force them to waste answers. Gladiator Skumm is also a pretty good way to harass them.

This.

Really you shouldn't be activating any donation quest until ring is on the chain. Of course if you have to you have to, or if you are confident that you are playing against something that will not be running any graveyard hard. However most of the time turns 1-3 (or 1-4 if you have to sit on a you, robot) should be spent keeping yourself alive and doing other stuff such as tutoring.

Personally I am still running the red "fat" version with 4 x Lor'Themar (invoke), Greench (soft-lock), and Doomwalker (to stabilize). I think lor'themar is a huge advantage for horde over alliance since you can combo with an alliance version and still scoop to an invoke if you fail to kill right then. Other sweepers are less of an issue (penance for example) since you can just simply ring again. That isn't quite the case against invoke.

Against mage they have precious few counters to hit ring with, unless we are talking about varanis in which case you are probably boned. Against say black ice the plan is to try and land an EOT ring when they try and stick dimzer. Unfortunately a smart player will just ride an early adam or glous + other dudes. The arena versions can probably cope with this by continually throwing dudes in the way until you can parry your way into a good position.

Personally I have gone to shaman (shalu for an additional answer to spell suppression). The problem now is that I am down 4 ways to make the ring instant by losing battlecast pants. However you do gain grounding totem which helps alleviate some of the problems. Further you get access to aegis which clearly does wonders against aggro which (as mentioned) has been a bit of a problem.

There are still problems with the deck in certain matchups. Varanis is a nightmare, warlock is problematic since they potentially have abyss walker's boots, cannibalize, undercity, invoke, AND eye of kilrogg. That is a ton of collatoral damage from things they are going to run anyway. Aggro is a problem is you don't have aegis as I have "stumbled" upon, I mean who knew aegis was so good against aggro? Although that can be mitigated by the version you play or how much extra removal/protectors you run.

Then there's weird things like tons-of-counters-warrior.dec where they are running 4 wreck MD, puncture, smash, and other stuff on top of it. Yes people are actively hating out ring decks...I mean really, what the hell?

Still, it's a combo deck it can still win through things if you can do the math right (and it has been). It's just a matter of getting the tweaks correct.

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wingedweasel on MWS/Lackey
winged weasel on xbl

I guess I am still missing the play with the wait to discard till the ring is on the chain.  That would mean you would of had to spend 5 resources to get you robot and the ring to go on at the end of his turn.  Then you are out of resources to discard. 

Otherwise you are putting the ring out and letting it sit for a turn, then its just going to get destroyed by any one of the many equipment/other optons to kill a card which anyone could/already is running against the ring.   

What am I missing?

2553717:

I guess I am still missing the play with the wait to discard till the ring is on the chain.  That would mean you would of had to spend 5 resources to get you robot and the ring to go on at the end of his turn.  Then you are out of resources to discard. 

Otherwise you are putting the ring out and letting it sit for a turn, then its just going to get destroyed by any one of the many equipment/other optons to kill a card which anyone could/already is running against the ring.   

What am I missing?

They mean the ring's effect at the start of your turn, not the ring itself. You would use the resources you readied for the turn and complete the donation quests before the ring's effect resolves.

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No quote for you!

So then I don't get "start of turn."

It says at the start of your turn destroy ring and then bla bla bla.

Are you saying you can do your quests before this?  After ready step?

Start of turn effects are added to the chain before you ready, and readying doesn't use the chain.  In response to the triggered effect of the Ring, you complete your donation quests.

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Kredistus - Blood Elf Paladin
Elune.